First of all, thanks to all of you for help on the countertop backsplash question! (backsplash to the wall or fastened to the counter?). If I were doing this for a living I would go for the smart-klips, but I just work on my own stuff and I don’t do counter tops often enough to justify the investment. I decided to fasten it to the wall and it worked out fine. I had to formica the counter in place rather than formica it off site and then install it, so the backsplash on the wall worked better. FYI: the reason I had to formica the top in place is because I used 3/4 birch plywood and it had a slight warp in it that didn’t go away after leaving it in place for awhile. I was afraid if I formica’d it and then screwed it down to the frame / cabinet base the flex would pop the top or crack the laminate. So I forced the warp out by screwing it down good (its not going anywhere) and then formicaing it in place. SHOULD HAVE READ THE OTHER POSTS ABOUT PLYWOOD VS. MDF! I don’t like MDF because of the weight – I end up lugging this stuff around myself most of the time. But next time it will be MDF.
OK so onto my next question. I have read alot of posts about kitchen flooring and I could use some advice. I have a vinyl sheet floor in a medium to small size kitchen. This is the first floor – installed when the house was built and it is about 11 years old. It needs to be replaced. I do not want to deal with sheet vinyl. I have installed it before – and I don’t like working with it. I also would like to avoid tearing up the old vinyl and subfloor. I think there is luan over OSB under it, but i am not sure. It is in good shape as far as curling etc. it is just worn out. What I would like to to do is something in squares, either ceramic or vinyl tile – so I can fit-as-I-go as opposed to the vinyl stuff where the whole sheet is cut to fit at once. I would also consider a plank type floor such as the “floating” or glueless floor systems by pergo etc.
I have heard some people talk about a liquid underlayment that is spread over the old vinyl to fill in uneven cracks etc. I could also put more luan over the old and then go with the next floor. The transition to the next room is already uneven beacuse the kitchen vinyl comes up to a hardwood floor that is about 3/16 to 1/4″ higher. So I could raise the floor a little and it would end up even with the other. Also, do you normally go under the built in appliances or in front of them? I think they can go up a bit as the stove – dishwasher have threaded legs for leveling so I think I can lower them and they would still fit under the counter. I suppose if you went in front it would be a pain if you had to slide them out and a higher floor was in front of them.
I also need a durable floor – two dogs (one big-one medium) and two kids are pretty tough on the floor. We also had our dishwasher blow a hose twice (Maytag mfgr defect – since remedied) and flood the entire kitchen. No problem with the old floor – just cleaned up the water and let it dry. But I wouldn’t want a repeat event to ruin all my work.
Well I was a bit wordy in this post so i will clam up and look forward to some good advice. Thanks!
Replies
But next time it will be MDF
Good choice.
I also would like to avoid tearing up the old vinyl and subfloor. I think there is luan over OSB under it, but i am not sure
Not a good choice. It limits your options. As you saw there are some hieght limitations as regards DWs and countertop heights. I would rip it out and start over, if only for this reason. there are others: unsable backer material already installed, floor has to much deflection for tile, possable water damage from water leaking around the old floor and damaging the underlayment, current floor covering coming up, and on and on...
It is in good shape as far as curling etc. it is just worn out. What I would like to to do is something in squares, either ceramic or vinyl tile - so I can fit-as-I-go as opposed to the vinyl stuff where the whole sheet is cut to fit at once. I would also consider a plank type floor such as the "floating" or glueless floor systems by pergo etc.
is it coming up? or bubbling? or cracks? or any indication that the water membrane part of it has been compromised?
kitchen vinyl comes up to a hardwood floor that is about 3/16 to 1/4" higher. So I could raise the floor a little and it would end up even with the other
you could put some tile thinset directly down on the current vinyl... what am I thinking, it wouldn't stick to the vinyl, never mind
I don't know any type of flooring that is only 3/16th to 1/4" thick. except sheet vinyl, and you don't want to deal with that.
Also, do you normally go under the built in appliances or in front of them?
There will be a number of people that will (harp :-) ) tell you that you need to absoulutly go under the appliances. these folks are 100% right
They will also recommend that you go under the cabinets, but it sounds like you have just replaced the counter top in there.
also need a durable floor
I don't have a clue how durable the floating floors are. I do know that you don't want a wood floor with those beveled edges in there trapping dirt.
Recomendation:
Rip the underlayment out. Evaluate the requirments for the floor option of your choice ( I like tile, it's up to you ) and start the job right.
none of the flooring choices you outlined are all that hard. there are spacific tricks to each one, but there are folks here that are experts in each type of floor.
post a couple of pictures and I am sure some will put some ideas out there.
Adam
Thanks for the help. I have been following alot of the old posts in the debate over tile over vinyl and also the laminate debate (pergo).
I will percolate on it for awhile. I think I'll just rip it up and start new with something else. I haven't demolished anything substantial in a while - kinda gettin' the itch. But I am not going under the cabinets. The existing floor doesn't even go under the cabinets.
Thanks again.
ripping out the old floor will be easy as pie, taking all the staples or possibly nails the last guy used to put the luan down, will be a royal pain.
If you go with laminate, go to a floor shop and ask for their opinion, many many many better options than that crap called pergo.
if you tile, you may run into problems making the d/w fit with the increased height.
I'd recommend that you rip up the old floor and underlayment and then have new resilient floor installed. This is not the kind of job that you'll save any money on doing it yourself.
personally I wouldn't use Pergo for anything other than a wall covering. I just don't like the way it doesn't hold up.
but then I wouldn't put a wood floor in a kitchen either. If you want wood in there put the old oak strip plank stuff ( not the T & G face nailed stuff) and have a good floor guy sand it out for you. staining and finishing a small area like a kitchen wouldn't be that hard.
of course you would have to put many many coats.
but I'd go with tile. or even more lino before pergo
chuckle, or even OSB, snort.... just kidding
Adam
You left the door wide open .
The best for wear would be tile , but you probably dont have a floor built for tile .
The vinyl sqaures ,,........ please , lets not even go there on this site .
Wood in a kitchen is risky and unforgiving in an accident.
Pergo is the best looking , cheapest choice and in your skill level . Check out Wilsonart too. Its a floating floor that will cover over what you have on the floor requireing no R&R except baseboard moldings . It will level to the other floor . It goes under appliances , but check dishwasher to see if there is enough room. You can buy it on the internet for about 2 bucks a foot .
If you had a concrete floor , Id say tile . Most applications of tile over wood is expensive in prep. Others may say tile anyway , but they would have to know the condition of the floor .
Tim Mooney
Thanks for the advice. The wife already nixed the ceramic tile option. Too cold, too hard etc. I think I'll look into the floating stuff. I read some old posts about caulking the edges all around to avoid water damage in the event of a leak. A guy in our church did the floating floor in his kitchen, he used something that had a real wood top layer rather than laminate - I think it was tarkett - but not sure. It looked pretty good. Might be weird having a wood floor of one kind butt up to the other wood floor of a different kind.
Best thing to do is go to the stores and look. The private shops give the best advice and then you can trot over to the big box like most customers . I know , Im bad , but I swear, they do it all the time . They used to do it to me .
Tim Mooney