My husband and I are preparing to build a home ourselves through the help u build program. I was wondering if the expert homebuilders out there can offer suggestions regarding how to decide which parts of the house should get top budget priority and which would be okay to cut corners on.
I understand that labor is a significant cost of homebuilding, and we will try to do what we can and contract out what we can’t.
We want a house built to last, but I also know that sometimes you can get similar results from less expensive materials. In other words, I am looking for a list or recommendations of best buys, rather than brand names or trendy items.
The house is about 3000 squate feet and will be tuscan style. We’d like it to be as authenticly tuscan as possible. We own the property.
Thanks much!
pegkip
Replies
OK, I think this is a great topic.
Splurge: On items that can't practically be added later:
Advantech subfloor vs OSB or plywood
Over built floor framing, don't accept maximum spans
Plywood sheathing as opposed to OSB
Super insulation...no fiberglass, instead use sprayed foam, blown cellulose, OR super insulated wall details
If in heating climate, radiant floor heat
small 1/2 bath powder room close to main entrance
High efficiency windows
Save:
Counter tops...start with laminate, can always add granite
Thoughtful design ala "The Not so Big House"...so that, for example, if you seldom dine formally, axe the formal dining room
If you are able, educated, and have time and energy, DIY plumbing and electrical provide more sweat equity per hour than framing, roofing, or drywall
Do not cut corners on anything that can't be easily changed, like the foundation, plumbing and electrical rough in, framing, etc. You could use cheaper carpet or window treatrments for the first couple of years cuz you could easily replace them when you have more money later. Same for plumbing fixtures and appliances. It's a shame to waste the money by putting in something cheap for a short term, but it would let you occupy the house.
I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.
Being your own contractor is a huge dilemma. I don't know what your level of experience or knowledge of homebuilding is but in reality, it is fairly complicated. I went through the same thing and realized that I don't know any of the local subs. I don't know the diference between the good or bad ones. I ended up hiring a GC and then started making the decisions where to cut and add. I wanted to make sure I got A+ work on the foundation, plumbing, framing and electrical. We splurged on Marvin windows, custom wood trim, wood floors and tile. When you say Tuscan I assume you are speaking of a fairly high level of finish. You might kick around the idea of a GC that allows you to do some of the work that you are comfortable with and let the subs do the rest. We still had a few problems but I had a single butt to chew.
Don't know what our level of expertise is...I suppose that is relative. We've done tons of DIY projects in our current home (i.e. low voltage wiring, floor and wall tiling, wall texture and paint, built-in cabinetry, base trim and crown molding, hw floors, stained concrete, replacing sinks & toilets, building shed and 2 story garage)
Help u build is a great program, you pay a set fee and get access to subs who have proven reliable and have provided quality work for the organization. You can do as much or as little work as you like.
Yes, Tuscan style requires a high level of finish. So that's why I'm interested in how to prioritize what absolutely needs to be top quality from the get-go, versus what we can do later. And also what has enduring quality versus what is the "buzz" right now. Would love to use "green" materials if the quality and price are right, but am concerned that many materials have not been time-tested.
"So that's why I'm interested in how to prioritize what absolutely needs to be top quality from the get-go, versus what we can do later."There are 2 "laters".One is what you can live with for 5 years and then replace.The other is what you can move in with unfinished and finish as you go.The counter top is of the former.Things like finish floors, trim, even paint and bathroom fixture for spare rooms.The later depends on how much the local insepctors will allow if you need a COO before moving in and also now much spare room that you have to move things around and work in.
Help u Build sounds like a great program. Tuscan style should use many of the natural products available. I think windows have a lot to do with the general look of the house, inside and out. Fixtures (lighting and plumbing) can be upgraded later but at additional expense. If you are following the Tuscan style of tile, plaster, stucco this seems to be the splurge to me. Cutting corners would be how much you intend to substitue materials like sheetrock for plaster. Ceramic for natural tile. It's a hard decision and can only be determined by what you like in the finished product. If you can afford the authentic tuscan style you will be better off in the long run for maintenance. I've always had an interest in the "old" ways of building houses. Stick built with sheetrock and composition roofs are much cheaper but they just don't last.
Pegkip,
Looks like you're into a great adventure. You've already received good information from two posters and will surely get more. If you would give a few more details the pros would be able to throw back a lot of useful stuff. Where is your land? Slab or full foundation? Second floor? Stick built or block? Type of roof? Lot description? Close neighbors? What parts of the construction do you think you are capable of doing yourselves and how much experience do you have? The more information you give, the more you'll get. This crew has a wealth of knowledge and is very generous.
Good luck, and have fun.
oldfred
Where is your land? near Austin, TX
Slab or full foundation? Slab
Second floor? mostly one floor except there is a tuscan style tower with 3 floors. the second floor of the tower is a single room with a storage room and the third floor accessed via spiral staircase is an "away room" with balcony.
Stick built or block? we had considered ISP with steel frame with but stick seems more reasonable
Type of roof? we'd like tile, but might go with concrete or composite. You can't really see much of the roof because the house sits on an 8-10' ledge as you approach
Lot description? 8 acres, building site is on a flat ledge on a hillside, we may need to do some (but not much) earthwork
Close neighbors? nearest is at least 100 yards away (probably farther)
What parts of the construction do you think you are capable of doing yourselves and how much experience do you have? well there are some things that we are capable of doing that would take too much time or that we wouldn't save enough $ on to make it worth our time. We wouldn't want to do the slab, framing, plumbing, major electrical, etc. We can do site clean up, tiling bathrooms and kitchen, low voltage electrical wiring, finish work on walls/trim, installation of fixtures, etc.
Exterior is to be mostly stone with stucco on the upper section of the great room (I think the plate there is 16' or 18') and on the tower. We need to decide on windows/doors - i.e. wood, wood-vinyl clad, or vinyl (I've read that aluminum is bad news)
We have a due west exposure on the view side of the house so we have a 15' deep covered porch on the western side.
We've already improved the road, installed the well, built a two-story combo pump house/garage, and have electrical to the site. The plans are nearing completion, but wanted to solicit advice before finalizing them.
Forgive me if I've left out any important details...I'm not sure what are the important features to point out....
Where is your land? near Austin, TX
Howdy, then, two hour-away neighbor <g>. Welcome to BT, too.
Slab or full foundation? Slab
In parts of Travis County, particularly the hilly bits, there's a lot to be said for a perimeter beam foundation being more efficient in both dollars and in use of materials. You also mentioned 'green' practices--it'd be shame to have a potential 4-5' tall space under the west floor edge, and/or the porch and not be able to put a colapsable bladder rainwater collection tank in there. Given the rainfall, and the rates for water (in your case the headache of lifting it from a well), having a ready reservoir of irrgation water is an asset.
You can't really see much of the roof because the house sits on an 8-10' ledge as you approach
That's 8-10' tall, not wide, I'm guessing <g>. The roof of abuilding often has an underappreciated impact. Some of the more "modern" steep pitched roofs have a large impact on the viewer, and more elevation does not lessen this as much as might be expected. Now, I've seen almost every possible kind of roof down there short of palm fronds. Some are poor choices, indeed. now, up the hill, on your own 8 acres, an "architectural" shingle might be overkill. So, you might be able to save there with a nice neutral 20 or 30 year "plain" shingle instead.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
You wouldn't be ex law enforcement would you? Your photo jsut strikes me that way. BTW, howdy from 3 hours north.
ex law enforcement would you?
Ex military (tho- the non-military portions of my family have been largely in LE).
BTW, howdy from 3 hours north.
Hmm, Tarrant, or Dallas County, perhaps? (Colin Co closer to 4 hours depending on the high 5 . . . <g>)Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Hey, the good guys always wear the white (or gray) hats. I'm in Somervell county.
I'm in Somervell county
Ah, over towards Glen Rose, then. Pretty country over there. Squaw Creek lake is not a bad little lake over there.
wear the white (or gray) hats.
Resistol calls it "silver mist." White is another $50; grey is $50 less <g>Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
With a slab house, it's essential to make sure that rainwater runs away from the house in every direction, and that the interior is higher than the exterior at every door. Our second house is a slab on very flat land (San Fernando valley), and we came real close to getting flooded.
Splurge on foundation, structure, roof, exterior walls, windows -- all the stuff that keeps the weather out. Also on plumbing and electrical -- the stuff that's in the walls, not necessarily the fixtures. Minimize doing temporary things that you'll tear out before they're used up. Instead, see what you can leave unfinished and still be allowed to move in. When we did my parents' house, they let us live in it with most of the interior walls just bare studs, and some of the non-bearing walls not even framed. That allowed us to complete rooms one at a time, and keep the chaos confined.
-- J.S.
Fill in your profile so we know your location. If you don't want to name the town or city, just name the county.
Some things that are real important in a mediterranean climate with earthquake potential, don't mean a darn thing in North Dakota.
Tuscan usually means clay tile roof, stucco, Venetian plaster walls inside with plaster returns on window and door openings, etc. If you are going the whole nine yards on interior finish levels, you need to let us know that, also.
Architect? Plans source? Engineer? How are you coming by your plans and specs?
You can cut corners on the finishing, flooring, cabinets, trim, doors windows, heating system, appliances, fixtures, shingles, showers/tubs and so on. Labor is not a significant cost by itself if you hire help by the hour, where labor becomes costly is in the price of the sub-trades.
And while you have decided to jump in and build the house yourself ( you will be from now on known as 'Jumpers') you might want to purchase some medical instruments and medical books and do all your own at home surgery.
Jumpers - that's cute. But we're using the UbuildIt approach that has been discussed in other threads on this bb. The local franchise is "help u build". So far it seems like they are holding their own in these discussions as a way for owner-builders to be involved in the building process while also working with reputable subs, getting assistance with fianacing, etc.
Be very wary of books, or at least approach them witha heavy level of sckiptism. Thier pictures are seductive and they make their case without regard to input or discussion from you or dissenters..
Susan's book for example shows all these nicely finished rooms with fabulous attention to detail.. All of which costs a tremendous amount of money.. Attempting to replicate those roooms on a modest budget and you wind up cheap looking and shoddy..
The real economic's are in the wise use of time and materials.. For example most construction units are mulitples of 4. a ten foot wall is simply a 12 foot wall with 2 feet of waiste. then the question becomes inside or outside measurements.. A room that is 12 feet on the outside and uses 6 inch thick walls will only be 11 feet on the inside.. Thus we have a foot of waiste.
I disagree with your idea of having others do the heavy stuff. Oftne the "labor" is done by a $60,000 a year carpenter or a $75,000 a year electrician if you work out the real costs of that carpenter/ electrican it's often over $50 an hour or maybe more.. I don't know what you earn but you can figure it out quickly. take your last years tax forms and look at your net earnings number.. now divide that by 40 and again by 52 and you can see how much you actually earn..
Shocking isn't it? Who's the cheapest labor on the job now?
so a 12' wall 6" thick on the inside is 13' on the outside with 3' of waste then..
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
ya need to learn yur materials a might better...
start real basic and build a 120SF shed... 1% waste... or less..
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
Wasn't that the size of Waldens house"?
theirs wasn't quite that big...
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming
WOW!!! What a Ride!
The best way is to leave unfinished what you do not need right away (if possible in your area, or with your financing) putting in cheap fixtures, carpet counter tops etc may seem like a good idea, but you either need to be prepared to live with them for their live span, or else you end up spending way more money in the end. Leave the extra powder room, spare bedroom, master bath etc and finish them over a few years as you can afford to. You need to put in good windows, and for the sake of relationships with neighbors finish the outside.
Unfortunately one of the issues with doing either way, cheap to start, or unfinished is if your situation changes. What are the chances you will have to move before you can get to replacing/finishing things off. How hard is it going to be to sell your place if it is in an expensive location, a high end design but finished cheaply or not at all?
I have been building my house for the last 3 threes and expect I will be at it for another 2. My wife and I have done everything our self except raise the frame and put on the SIP panels (And we even provided the unskilled labour for that). We are doing this because in the end we will have a house we couldn't afford to have had built. And we have the satisfaction of knowing we did it ourselfs. On the other had I also work from home and work for myself so I can take the time to do this myself. And our particular situation where we had an existing house on the property to live in makes things easier as well. How much are you going to be able to get out to your house to work on it, how long will it take and how much time do you have. After all if you are going to provide some of the labour or do some of the work you need to be able to be there at the proper time in the project to complete things, or assist and that may mean the abilility to go out any day of the week.
Robert
The Spec House from Hell thread is required reading for all newbies. (Welcome to the board, by the way)
You might also want to read the thread on Floor Vibration.
It also found Dan Quayle's Vietnam era 3 wood at the bottom of a lake at an Indianapolis golf course.
I agree with what others have said, don't skimp on structural items, insulation, and HVAC, and save money on items that can be replaced later, like carpet.
Other places to save money are the children's rooms and rooms no one sees or you don't spend time in. For example, you can install expensive light fixtures and expensive finishes in the kitchen, living room, foyer, and so forth. But for children's bed rooms, plain drywall, cheap doors, and basic carpet are fine. For light fixtures in the bedrooms and hallway, a $5 ceiling mount fixture is plenty fine. Bedrooms in general are a big area to save, because you're only in there 5 minutes in the morning and 5 minutes at night other than when you have your eyes closed.
A guest bath or family bath is another place to save. Basic fixtures, vanity, towel bars, etc. are fine.
On landscaping, don't skimp on topsoil around the foundation where you expect to plant something besides grass. If you just dump subsoil, or only a couple of inches of topsoil, your expensive plantings won't grow.
You don't need a paved driveway either, right away, but do put a good base of crushed stone a foot deep and two feet wider than the finished paving will be. Driving on it for a couple of years contributes to it settling.
I found upgrading fiberglass insulation in 2 x 6 walls from R-19 to R-21 was money well spent.
I wouldn't waste a dime on any home automation system. Light switches work fine and don't break or take exceptional skill to install.
Agree with making sure the structure is perfect.
Besides that, pick a few things that you will use a lot and make a present to yourselves. For example, pick a cheap toilet in a seldom used bath, but maybe get one with a really good fitting seat for the bathroom you'll use most often. Might sound silly, but our Kohler toilet is sooooo much more comfortable than another brand we got to save money, and even though it cost too much, it's worth it in the end. (pun intended)
A kitchen faucet is used a lot. Get one you will really like using rather than skimping and then grumbling every time you touch it.
Find a few items you'll touch repeatedly and make them right. Heck, make them birthday presents to yourselves instead of more pedestrian items.
If you aren't in a hurry and interest on loans doesn't kill you then you can save a ton just by going slow... gives you time to think, plan, and find deals... but what might be a great deal for one might cost more for another...
1.you can never go wrong with quality...
2. never finance on a 30 year note things that only last 5...
3. if you do nothing but keep the place clean... supply coffee & cokes and are nice to the guys work'n on your place you'll come out ahead...
stuff you can do... that cost a ton if someone else does em...
concrete counter tops... cost of materials might be $2sf vs $50 if someone does it for you
pex plumbing... won't save on materials... but you will on labor
EBAY... you can sometimes find new in the box $500 plumbing fixtures for $100 it's only a deal if you can use it....
electric service... set one box once... ie: don't pay for a temp. box if there is anyway you can install the mian house box upfront... sometimes you can sometimes you can't...
ask for discounts... get more than one bid (2) and if they are way different get a third... offer to pay cod for materials if you can get a 2% discount...
everyone has to make a living so never pinch a guy thats make'n a living... but if your 30 day job will support him all year... find someone else...
pony
Splurge on the future. Save on the near term.
Put money into a top notch foundation and frame. Similarly the main plumbing lines and electrical runs are best overbuilt. These are things that once in place are impossible, or a real PITA, to work on.
Think about the framing. If it is overbuilt you might be able to add a second floor without problem. If it is only marginal, or worse below reasonable standard, it is going to be a major pain to upgrade or replace.
Think about the house as if you were renovating. What would you want to see to make the job go smoothly. Think access. Attics and crawl spaces and chases. Removable panels.
Given a solid structure and utility main runs sized and placed for easy upgrading your set.
Most everything else can be easily worked on at any later date. Remember that he exterior and exterior skins, trim, doors and windows and cabinets are all comparatively easy to replace. So if you buy cheap ones now to get you by for a few years while sinking the money into the more important things you can always come back to them.
Too often I see just the reverse thought process. Too often the money is all 'up front'. It goes into Italian marble tiles and top dollar cabinets while the structure is neglected. The electrical system passes code but no more than that. Some times barely, IMHO, passable.
Houses like this are bounded as to what they can be. They often will always be pretty features hung on a shoddy, often ill planned, structure.
On the other hand I walk into some homes that exude a feeling of solidity and strength. Of good planning and deep value. often they have cheap fittings but the trained eye looks past these things. Seeing instead the 'diamond in the rough' of the house and how, over time, this house is going places. It is going to grow with the people.
4LORN1,Great post. I especially like your sentences below:"On the other hand I walk into some homes that exude a feeling of solidity and strength. Of good planning and deep value. often they have cheap fittings but the trained eye looks past these things. Seeing instead the 'diamond in the rough' of the house and how, over time, this house is going places. It is going to grow with the people."I built a home in my 20's and the interior lights were keyless lampholders for many years. It was fine, because the bones were solid, and the design was a good fit for our life. We lived there for 15 years, and even added a third floor in the attic. After all that time, there were only a few areas that were not right, and I would have fixed them if we had stayed there.The concept of a home as a dynamic, evolving entity, is one that few owners seem to grasp when they build. If possible, it is best to go slowly, since you cannot know what you like until you are in the space for a time.Bill
My wife and I recently moved into our house. Our home is mostly timber -framed w/ a stick frame Ell. Insulation is SIP and "blown-in" cellulose thru the Ell.
Happy building!! and we hope to hear of your progress.
daveinnh
How about thinking about a smaller house. 3000sf is alot of house.(I know I know they build them bigger). But you could save ALOT of money by scaleing down and future heating cooling cost would be substantial. Remember heating cooling cost are NOT going to be getting cheaper. I predict the era of monster houses is coming to a close.
Think of it this way..what ever you scale down you'd automatically save off of your material cost. What to save a 1/3 on build materials?"The purpose of life is rapture. Here and now"
I was going to suggest the same thing, but didn't want to get hammered for being a socialist or something. (You are definitely fearless in this regard.)
The suggestions posted are great and helpful, assuming such a house is to be built, but no one questions the premise of the project. "Tuscan" house? In Texas? What does Tuscany have to do with Texas? Sono pazze, quelle persone! How many people will be occupying this monster? How much energy will be used to keep it cool in the Texas summer? Could the guys building this house ever dream in living in a house like it?
What does Tuscany have to do with Texas?
Quite a few Itialian-descended Texans, particularly in central Texas. Milano, in Milam County, has some Millanese (not a huge surprise), the farm folks around Herne are largely Siciliian.
So, it could be family heritage; it could also be that the tuscan architectural style is warm and embracing. Travis County is arid enough, in rain and in humidity, to benefit from Tuscan design.
How much energy will be used to keep it cool in the Texas summer?
With some smart design, not as much as it might seem. Use a Mooney wall, and an insulated ceiling deck (10-12" deep of insulation), then "float" the roof deck as an "sun shade" over that, gives excellent energy performance. Use of good shading will help too. We built some houses near Lake Travis in the 3-4K sf range that were running $350-500 annual cooling & heating cost (in mid-80s dollars). Those were also some pretty extreme houses, too, where comfort was sacrificed to efficency. But there's no reason that a well-designed house cannot out perform one of the Williamson County McMansions, with their $200-300 per month electric bills.
Could the guys building this house ever dream in living in a house like it?
Maybe not. They might not want to live in the exclusion that 8 acres provides. Their kids might be more comfortable living in the same neighborhood as their school. They might even like a house that is "better" than the ones they build, too.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
I thought of something else. If you can buy a fair quantity of materials from any one supplier, you can talk them into discounts. Sometimes they are not that large, but sometimes they are. For example, when you are shopping for appliances, if you get prices from the salesman and are pretty well narrowed down with what you want, ask "what discount will you give me if I buy the fridge, stove, oven, and dishwasher all from you?". Almost always they'll knock off a little more. This could work for lighting fixtures, bathroom fixtures, cabinets, all sorts of things.
Another place to save is to not buy appliances you can move from another home. If your washer and dryer still work, even if they only have a couple of years life left, why throw money away on new?
I agree that energy conservation means have improved over the years but the fact remains a 3000sg ft house is always going to consume far more energy than a 1500sgft one. And my point was that even with good conservation energy prices are really going to climb."The purpose of life is rapture. Here and now"
3000sg ft house is always going to consume far more energy than a 1500sgft one
Well, yeah.
So that's a valid consideration. Now, there's another in that this house is on an 8 acre site, too. Even if it's 50% "buildable" (some of the hillside lots in Travis County are like that), that means there's only 4 two-acre "potential" building sites on the lot. A 3000 sf house on 1 acre is not an unreasonable size of house (just for number crunching's sake--bank notes are not drafted on "social justice" lines <g>).
To pick a half-donkeied number, let's use $110/sf, that makes the 3000 sf "worth" $330K, about an even third of a million. "Cheap" land with a view in Travis Co, is about $6-10K the acre. That makes the land about 3% the house cost. In olden days, the "banks" "wanted" you to have the land be 10% the house cost (I've seen some Austin prices much closer to 1.5% & 2% of late, though).
For some slight perspective, in an Austin subdivision, a third of a million is likely only going to buy you 2200-2500 sf, and that on a 4-5 house per acre lot.
Now, the argument about should people live in huge houses has some merit, or, at least, it's worth discussing. Just not here, I'm thinking.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
While I don't favor the style, there are many Tuscan, Mediterranean and French country style houses here. Austin is known as the Hill Country and has a similar arrid type look to it. I agree on out of place architecture but these seem to be at home here. One stuck out by itself on a ranch may not look right but built in a development of similar houses it would fit right in.
I went to a south TX hunting ranch back in Dec. and stayed in a large beautiful house that was French/Med style and built in 1918. That area would now be known for Hispanic culture. However the early settlers where German, Czech, Norwegian, Scandanavian and French. I can show you a Norwegian town south of here that would make you wonder "what the heck are these houses doing here and why are the men wearing skirts and drinking beer".
There is also a style known as Hill Country style house that has strong Prarie influences and really fits right in.
I agree 100%. I think have all of Sarah Susanka's books and have read her articles in the Taunton magazines. However, my hubby is not like-minded. He is in the "must have the latest and greatest" camp. Plus, we've worked with two different designers who couldn't seem to design a house for us within the 2500 sq ft limit we initially set. If I were calling the shots, we'd be talking about a smaller, finely crafted, green home and I'd be working with a team of folks who really know what they are doing and who would take the time and have the knowledge to do things right (within the parameters that we set). But that isn't the way things are going to go. So I have to work within the constraints I've been given.
There was a smaller, finely done home featured in a Fine Homebuilding article a couple years ago. It is somewhere near Austin, on a large country lot, and "green" was its buzzword.
As I recall it, an Austin-area architect did it. Had a big cistern for collecting water, and the outdoor porch was built atop the cistern.
Quite fine details inside and out. You might want to can your archie and find this guy.
Can anyone recall this article? I've got all my stacks of past issues, but really don't want to go looking through them right now.
That was a good article, now that you mention it. I can't remember which issue, but it was in the last 2-3 years, because I was doing similar rainwater collection stuff in the same general area.
As a result of that, I'm a big fan of the bladder systems. They simplify the waterproofing no end, there's less "open air" area to collect "stuff," and they're a bit more "scaleable" than other solutions. That last is very handy, you can put a crawlspace in under things like garages and porches, and add the bladder tank later. Or remove them.
Now, I guess I'll have to go home and look for the postit hanging out of that issue (among the many so "flagged").Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
I had to laugh out loud. My old issues all look like "flag day" with the post-its and dog-ears. I wish I could fit a bookcase in my bathroom... but my wife wouldn't like it too much...
Billy
My old issues all look like "flag day" with the post-its and dog-ears.
No lie. Even worse with the "ears" & flags bent over from being in periodical boxes . . .
For my computer & cad pubs, I finally just started ripping out the pertaininent section and chunking them in a hanging folder. When no more will go in, I yank them all out and can the ones that are obsolete ("10 Top Tune-up for Windows 3.1!").
Just can't do that to my FHB, though.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Yeah, and the CD just doesn't have the same feel as the old magazines.
The only CapnMac I knew was a Bahamian dive skipper in Davis Harbour, Eleuthera. Great guy. Nice Buffet quote by the way.
Billy
Yeah, and the CD just doesn't have the same feel as the old magazines.
And they just don't "highlighter" very well . . . <g>
Nice Buffet quote by the way.
Well, there's an old song about "Hank Williams, You Wrote My Life," I seem to have spent too much of my life trying to live Bubba's songs.
Ran into a chum with a bottle of rum (on Lime Key, I think).
Tried to rescue some coeds from their condos (on more than one occasion); been the, and suffered, gypsies in the palace.
Lost the shaker of salt; stepped on a pop-top; ran out of limes.
Pretty sure I met Desdemona more than once, too.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
Was the Cordoba blue or red?
I see General Electric's still doing their best...
If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane!
Billy
Was the Cordoba blue or red?
Couldn't say, I had "patriotic" (thanx Duane) eyes <G>.
I see General Electric's still doing their best...
I saw a blender with power by Briggs&Stratton two-stroke, that caused some of "those flashbacks they all warned us about" (and I grew up being that "people" other parents warned about <g>) . . .
If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane!
And there may or may not be a woman to blame. Have not broken my leg nor crashed my plane--so it's all to the good. Might find as many witnesses to sane as not, so that's ok, too.
Second coolest JB moment: Jerry Jeff Walker birthday bash in Austin, and event I wander off to on regular basis. Four years ago, the lights dim, there's some slides of vaguely familiar places, and vaguely familar faces; the curtain goes up, and it's just JJW & Bubba, reliving the Key West days in a two set, just the two of them, in alternating duets of songs we all (mostly) knew oh so well.Occupational hazard of my occupation not being around (sorry Bubba)
>The only CapnMac I knew was a Bahamian dive skipper in Davis Harbour, Eleuthera.Eleuthera?!?!?!Been to Harbour Island....Home of Happy People? I was married there!
Great Cloud -- it's a beautiful place. Those pink sand beaches. The first time I went to Eleuthera was 1979. I've been up & down the island, drank lots of rum, watched the effects of drug running (some wealthy people, some broken lives), and did lots of spearfishing on the beautiful reefs. I haven't been there in years. Different life now. ;-)
How are things working out with your neighbor?
Billy
Such memories. Those beaches were amazing. Brought some of the sand home...freaked out the custom's people a bit. I heard the beaches were decimated by a hurricane the other year. Maybe I should send the sand back...
The online index keeps bring me to #163 page 86.But the discriptions does not match.http://www.taunton.com/store/pages/fh_toc_163.asp
I remember the article. I think the house won a green building award?
Billy
Edited 3/3/2005 6:04 pm ET by Billy
All good advise so far, If you do indeed act as your own GC, just remember the "impossible triad"......
Good, Fast, or Cheap......you can have any two, but never all three.
Good luck.
2 Things to consider:
(1) How much is your time worth? I believe labor construction labor is very cheap in your area. If you make as much $/hr or more than the labor rate you are probably better off contracting out all the work.
(2) What are the chances you will need to sell the house? What happens if you lose your job or get transferred? If you have an unplanned need to sell the house you could be in trouble if it is unfinished.
Good Luck!
Mike K
Amateur Home Remodeler in Aurora, Illinois
I think it is a control issue. "If you want things done right, do it yourself" mentality. We will leave that heavy labor to the laborers (I hope).
where you intend to live has a dramatic effect on your priorities. Here in Minnesota for example (and I should imagine in the extreme south as well) energy efficency becomes very important. Here it's keeping heat in during the winter, there I can imagine it's keeping heat out during the summer.
I've found the use of SIP's instead of tradional building methods to be the greatest energy savers. In addition the use of SIP's is dramatically cheaper than traditional stick building and insulation. I should imagine a design that calls for heavy overhangs will be extremely helpful as well.
As we age, maintinance chores will become a greater and greater burden on us and with that in mind I made certain that my exteriors wasn't plastic siding or wood that would need frequent painting. rather I used stone as my exterior siding although stucco or adobe might be cheaper for you.
In the south I can imagine that roofing shingles would need frequent replacement and with that in mind I'd be inclined to spend money on a tile roof rather than a shingle roof.
My lowest priorities would be those rooms that tend to "date" themselves. Styles that are currant today will quickly age themselves. In their place use simple and basic rather than better . In the late fifties my mother had all the fixtures in the bathrooms replaced with pink fixtures. (yeh, a pink toilet) 4 years later when we tried to sell the house no-one failed to comment negatively about the pink fixtures.
If she'd left the basic white ones alone no one would have said anything and even if they'd wanted something differant they would have expected to replace the fixtures themselves.
I disagree that smaller is always better. It really depends, for example I'm building a larger house with the intention of having my daughters live with us instead of having them go off and buy their own house. I need a larger house to make that attractive. If you know that a relative or family memember that might in the future count on you for support why not add the space now. It's not neccesary to finish it, it can be left totally bare. but the space is there and can quickly be modified as needed.
Parts of Texas will need a way to collect water. having a way to keep rain water in storage can allow you to keep an expensive lawn/garden/trees&plants green. I should imagine that it's far more important than putting in a lawn immediately or having the property landscaped. You'll tear up any lawn or landscaping putting a storage system in place afterwards do it before and you won't have to do it again.
Been following these ideas since the beginning and agree with most folks here. Take your time planning. Think about designing and orienting the house to combat local climate problems.
A couple things that are easy to do, that make a world of difference to me are door hardware - cheap hinges look cheap and loose pins allow the leaf to hang slopilly. A door knob is something you touch countless times over the life of the building. Invest in smooth feeling, heavy hardware, you'll get a sensation of quality every time you go through a door.
The other easy to make mistake is using 3/4 extension drawer slides. I don't even know why they make those things. For a couple bucks more per drawer you can have 100 pound, full extension slides that will save you move frustration that you'd imagine. It's something you might not think about amidst all the decisions you make while building a house. Dovetailed drawers are a waste of money; high quality full extension hardware is a great investment.
pegkip,
My wife and I built our 'dream house' about a year ago and spent some time thinking about this as well. We decided that it's easier, and cheaper in the long run, in doing things 'right' the first time. By right I mean to our satisfaction, so they won't require ripout and/or replacement down the road. We did a very careful budget workup and decided to save our money for another year and did not regret it. We did delay a couple of things, like the built in entertainment system cabinets and built in book shelves. Other than that we focused on saving costs by managing the project well, in other words ensuring our bid spec's were very complete and understandable, which we worked on during the extra year. We managed to complete the house in 17 weeks and were 3% under budget.
Good Luck
Good suggestions. Particularly regarding scrutinizing the bids.
If I am interpreting much of the discussion correctly, one way to save would be to leave some rooms unfinished (if code allows). And then work on them later as budget and time allow. Better to do it right from the start than to do something "temporary" only to rip it out or redo it a few years down the road.
Leave the landscaping for later - at least until rainwater collection/greywater systems have been installed.
pegkip
I think you got the gist of my message. Landscape is a good example of something that can be done later. However, if you can plan out your landscaping ahead of time you might be able to save some money there too. For example, we have a sunken patio with large stone steppers that can only be installed by equipment, which would not have had access once our house was completed. We had our excavator dig out the area during initial excavation and had the steps installed by a fork lift. We completed the patio ourselves once we moved in.
Good Luck - Jack
For landscaping, it's better to do later the parts that are vulnerable to getting trashed in the process of building. But if you plant early the things that are in safe places and take a while to grow, it'll look less barren when you move in.
-- J.S.
I just asked a friend of mine who is building the same thing...do you ever get to the point where you don't have to answer "do we hold back or go for it?" several times during the day?
We haven't done outrageous things but, so far, we have opted to go the extra mile on the structural things and we are not sorry. Advantech is wonderful, it makes the house feel so solid. We beefed up our crawl space foundation and went with four HVAC zones vs. three, and went with 2 x 6 framing. As one other poster mentioned, you can feel the value in the home when you walk in.
We thought about doing some things ourselves but decided that time away from our business would cost more than what we could pay someone else to do it and the potential for making mistakes because we are not builders could cost more than whatever savings we thought we could achieve. Are we over budget?....you have no idea! But, we have no regrets and our home has turned out infinitely better than what we had ever imagined.
Good luck!
Someone mentioned Advantech earlier in the thread (maybe it was you). Is there a thread on Advantech? What is it and are there comparables? Is it an OSB? SIP?
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:pqKB3pl8uRIJ:ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/build/msg0214024125462.html
+advantech+subfloor&hl=en
Gee, I hope I pasted this thread correctly. I had to separate the last line, but you should copy and paste all of the info above in your address window.
It is like OSB but infinitely better. We went with the 1 and 1/4 inch (I think that is right) and it is Tongue and Groove. Very solid. It was exposed to the open weather for about 7-8 weeks and didn't de-laminate as plywood or OSB would do. It did swell at the seams, contrary to what the mfg. warranty states. Our lumber representative is going to try to get some sort of concession for us on that, but we are really happy with it.
Good luck.
Here's another place I found out the hard way I would not waste money again. (Sorry if one of the other messages already said this.)
A whirlpool tub. When building my dream house I was all excited to have, finally, a whirlpool tub. The first time I used it, I was disappointed. First, it was noisy. The place to rest your head is over the pump. Second, the tub vibrated like crazy from the pump motor. Not because there was anything wrong with the pump, but pumps are not exactly Magic Fingers beds. It's like resting your head on a swimming pool filter. Between the noise and the vibration it was an annoying experience.
American Standard's own research says the average whirlpool tub gets used 7 times. That's a lot of money per bath.
You can run wires for a security system and add the system later. You can run plastic tubing for a central vac system and add the system later. Don't forget to run lots of Rg6 or similar cable for communication and cable TV connections. I put cable on each side of my rooms along with phone outlets in case I moved furniture around.
You may want to run some 4 gauge wire out to your garage in case you ever want to put a sub-panel out there.
Also run 5" PVC pipe under your drive way and you will be able to pull wires under there without having to tear up concrete or blacktop.
Charlie