Replies

1. 
   WorkshopJon | Dec 15, 2003 08:39am | #1

   "Or should we skip that and just hire someone to consult us first?  Do we need an architect, designer, or both?  We are in north east Connecticut."  

   Steve,

   I think you need to give more details.......And post a few digital pics if you really want to get a response.

   Jon

1. 
   hardwebb | Dec 16, 2003 04:54pm | #14

   Thanks guys for all the great responses. We are going to heed everyones advice and have an architect over tommorow.  That should at least get the ball rolling.  Yes, we live in the house, but will to move into the apartment upstairs if necessary while repairs are done.  I plan to do a lot of the work myself other than any major plumbing or structural work.

   I have few more questions.  First, any advice on getting rid of mice?  This house has a dirt basement and stone foundation, so they are in the basement but also in the walls and ceiling.  I'm using traps, but dont want to use poison because I'm concerned that the carcasses will be left where I cant get at them.

   Next question.  I read an article in FB recently about moisture control in the basement.  It suggested laying down a moisture barrier [plastic or polyethylene I think].  I'm wondering how dry the basement has to be.  And what about mold growth, will it stop for the most part or get worse?

   Thanks again for all your great help.   Steve

1. 
   PeteBradley | Dec 16, 2003 06:09pm | #15

   You'll probably get more responses if you start separate threads for your new questions.

   Pete

1. 
   hardwebb | Dec 16, 2003 06:17pm | #16

   Ok, thanks.

2. 
   plantlust | Dec 15, 2003 08:45am | #2

   How recently is recently?

   I suggest living in your new house (and yard) for about a year.  Unless something really drastic needs replacing, it will give you time to get a feel for what you both really want.  It will also give you time to cut photos out of magazines, visit some open houses, Cavalcade of Home, and other home shows to get ideas. 

   With such a nicely aged home it would be a shame to do a slapdash job and then regret it later.

   (It took me about 6 months to find the right color "white" tile to go with the cobalt blue tile I got for my kitchen.  Went from splitpea soup green to cobalt blue/white.  What a relief when that got done!)

   If I were kind and adoring, how would that be?...very boring       ?

3. 
   Davo304 | Dec 15, 2003 10:31am | #3

   I disagree with comments by Plantlust that you should live there a year or more before remodeling. The longer you wait, the harder it will be to remodel. The longer you live in a place, the more stuff you accumulate; making it just that more harder for you and/or your contractor to work around.

    Ideally, it would be much simpler to be living somewhere else while the remodeling is taking place...that is if you plan on doing "major" remodeling to most of the house. And, building materials are constantly going up in price...take for example the cost of plywood these days. In just the last 2 months, plywood prices have skyrocketed to 3 times it's original price! The longer you wait, the more expensive the job will become.

   Looking at books and home magazines is a good place to start to get a "feel" for what kind of "period" you want to renovate your house into. ( example...do you wish to keep the farmhouse looking like a farmhouse, or do you wish to remake it into something more contemporary?)

   Bottom line though is to consult with a builder designer and/or an architect. Seek out either type that may come highly recommended from any of your friends who have had similar renovations in the past. If no names come to mind, check the Yellow Pages under Architects.

   A good architect or build/designer will be someone who listens well and can get a grasp on your needs. They should be insightful, and fun to work with. If you don't mesh well with this person after one or two meetings, then I would suggest you drop this person and look again for another.

   These professionals can give you really good insights as to what would be practical, and doable for your unique situation. They will have access to many plans and assessories that would make your remodel "stand out." They can pin point materials and objects that can be readily available; but because these items are not always on hand for viewing at your nearby  local stores...you would never have thought to incorporate them into your remodel in the first place.  Such "touches" cannot always be found or thought of by thumbing thru books and mags.

   LOL.

   Davo

4. 
   MajorWool | Dec 15, 2003 12:34pm | #4

   Have you moved in yet? Refinishing floors is much easier if you aren't living there yet. Also, do you need to do any basic preventative electrical and plumbing work. What did the home inspector say about these systems? Is the roof in good shape, insulation? In many ways it is a chicken and egg dilema. You may find yourself paying twice for similar work in one area if you do something right now and then decide a year later to move a wall or get new cabinets. But, if you decide that you need new siding, then it always good to see what else you need or want to at the same time while the boards are off.

5. 
   BossHog | Dec 15, 2003 03:58pm | #5

   I'd suggest doing structural stUff first.

   Like take care of any leveling or jacking issues first. You don't want to install a new kitchen then find out you need to jack up that corner of the house, whIch would make your new cabinets unlevel.

   Then would be the roof and siding. No sense putting in new carpet somewhere only to have the roof leak on it.

   After that it's hard to say without looking at the place.

   I live in a crummy apartment.
   Once, opportunity knocked and a wall collapsed.

6. 
   ian | Dec 15, 2003 04:16pm | #6

   If your thinking along the lines of remodelling the kitchen, bath, and sunroom, and enlargen the living room or move it to another part of the house I suggest you serriously consider a knock down and rebuild.  The charm / value of an old house is the age, layout and the construction technology.  Make too many changes and all you have is an 1840s shell with 21st century internals.   

7. 
   dIrishInMe | Dec 15, 2003 04:31pm | #7

   Identify, prioritize, quantify, plan, execute. 

   First, identify items that first attracted you to the home - ie wide board floors, cedar shake siding, or whatever and make plans to preserve/restore these items.  Also identify negatives - out of character finishes, etc, no master bath - whatever.  Then, make a comprehensive list of what has to be done, and what you want to do.  You may want to get the help of a home inspector, if you did not already go through that during the purchase process.  They are good at picking up problems, especially those that could be safety related or items that could effect the longevity of the structure.   Then prioritize your list putting things at the front that are required to insure that the house is weatherproof, safe and effect the home's livability.  (unusable bathrooms or a broken kitchen sink are no fun)  Also include things up at the front on the list that will require tear-out of finished surfaces - plumbing, wiring, structural items, etc.  In your plans for remodeling/redeployment/addition of space, give careful consideration as to how these items can be accomplished without ruining the original character/charm of a house.  For example, you may want to put more of that wide board flooring in the addition, rather than slap some engineered wood product in...  I think any remodeler will tell you that a successfully addition project is one that when complete, looks like it was always there, and belongs with the house.  Then start to carefully assign dollar and time values to each item on the list.  Once that is done, multiply all dollar figures by 2 and all the time figures by 3.  Seriously!  Now that you have identified and quantified the scope of the project, make a plan of attack.  It might be to move out and live somewhere else while the project is executed full tilt.  It might be one or 2 rooms at a time, it might be exterior first, then interior.  It might be remodel the upstairs bath while the painter redoes the exterior.  Large projects are not normally accomplished in an entirely serial fashion.

   Get some professional help in the area of design of any space to be added; it will show in the end product.  Lastly, don't try to do too much yourself.  A lot of people get so hung up on saving money, they end up with a 5 year project, or a perpetually unfinished one.  If you have a cheap source of financing (borrow money from parents, borrow from 401k plan, tax deductible home equity line, etc) use it so the project won't last too long.  Materials and services won't be any cheaper in 2 years then they are right now. 

   Good Luck,

   Matt

   
   

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   Edited 12/15/2003 9:07:57 AM ET by DIRISHINME

8. 
   rjw | Dec 15, 2003 04:57pm | #8

   This is a great site, of course, but I suggest you also use the resources of "The Old House Journal."

   Those folks are entirely involved in issues of working in old houses, and you'll not only find good technical information (in most cases) but also a lot of "meta-information" about working on old houses, such as which to do first.

   _______________________

   ---

   Tool Donations Sought

   I'm matching tool donors to a church mission to Haiti - we're shipping a bus converted to a medical facility in January (we hope) and can fill it with clothes, tools and all sorts of stuff needed in that poorest of all countries. A few hand tools or power tools can provide a livelihood for an otherwise destitute family. Please email me if you have tools to donate.

   Thanks to Jeff and David and Jim for their offers!

9. 
   MarkMc | Dec 15, 2003 05:03pm | #9

   All I can offer is my own experience doing my 100+ farmhouse.

   First, as pointed out by Davo, if you move in, you add time to the remodel. That adds cost.

   So, I put DW and kids up in an apartment and I stayed out in the barn. We gut rehabed the building. Geothermal HVAC, 400 amp service w/ new wiring, plumbing, tuned up the log joists, addition, walls, saved the beadboard ceiling, restored the trim and doors, in other words, a 21st century under a 19th century shell.

   Charming, and moved in with 100g in equity. I doubt I'd have the same house if I had done a tear-down.

   Yeah, get a consultant, architect, whatever. Try not to move in, and try not to get divorced. Luck.

10. 
    PeteBradley | Dec 15, 2003 05:41pm | #10

    Wow.  An 1840s farmhouse in NE Connecticut.  As others have pointed out, there are a lot of irreplaceable aspects to a house like that.  While the other posts are correct that the fastest/cheapest approach is to remodel before you get in, I think there's a lot to be said for living in it (or at least spending some serious time planning) so you can determine exactly what you want to change.  There's a natural tendency to want to change a lot, but the results aren't always satisfactory.

    Having seen a few older CT houses in recent years, I can say that there are a lot more bad to awful remodels than good to great ones.  The bad ones weren't necessarily cheap either. 

    I think the ones that work best are the ones that have "seamless" upgrades.  For example, suppose the kitchen is outdated.  You could put in a super-modern kitchen with lots of stainess steel, the latest light fixtures, and everything else shown in "Fancy Kitchen Magazine".  The kitchen might look spectacular, but it then clashes with the rest of the house.  The better alternative is to choose your materials and styles to fit in with the character of the house.  You get a kitchen with all the modern conveniences that enhances the house.

    A personal suggestion is "when in doubt, do less".

    Whatever you do, plan, plan, plan.  For example, in a lot of houses of that period, the rooms on the second floor interconnect w/o a hallway to get from front to back.  Some people are ok with that, some want to change it.  The "solutions" that I've seen suggest that most folks spent about a day deciding what to do, then rushed out to Home Depot for the latest in ornate molded tile to encase the bathroom in.  The result is an odd alley and an out of place bathroom, both of which detract from your enjoyment of a fine house (not to mention resale value).

    Enjoy your house, and keep us posted,

    Pete

11. 
    hammer1 | Dec 15, 2003 09:22pm | #11

    Antique houses are much like building a brand new one. You start with the foundation and site work and go up from there. There are generally some major issues to address and costly ones. A home inspector can be an inexpensive way to get a report on your major issues, electrical, plumbing, furnace, etc. Much will depend on what other owners have done in the past. A good remodeling contractor can put you in touch with electricians and plumbers and others that can asses what you have and what is needed for what you wish to do. If the house has not had any major work done for years you can expect everything to take longer and cost more. Add 30% to any estimates and you may be OK. Sorry if the truth hurts but bringing an old timer up to modern standards does require a commitment.

12. 
    xMikeSmith | Dec 15, 2003 09:38pm | #12

    hard... if we were involved with your home.. first would be measured drawings of exactly what you have..

     identify all problem areas.. ( structural... roofing... drainage... landscaping... zoning issues... septic issues )

    then we'd prioritize your needs and desires..

    if the whole laundry list is  doable.. ( in terms of your budget ).... but you want to live in the house during construction.. then a phased design would be called for..

     if you could vacate the house for the duration...  and  you wanted to tackle the  whole thing in one contract... then the  entire scope of work would be included in the original design work..

     a good architect or designer could do this for you ... or a design /build firm could do the whole thing..

     have fun...but i'd skip the books and software part as far as doing it yourself.. the books  would be nice in terms of organizing your  wish list... and your "like this --- hate that " type of thing.. but ...

     if you want to get it as close to right as possible the first time out... then stick with experience...

    if this is going to be the first of say three houses you will do together in your married life... then have at it...  the fun may  equal the heartaches.... and the tuition for your education won't come cheap

    Mike Smith   Rhode Island : Design / Build / Repair / Restore

    
    

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    Edited 12/15/2003 1:44:39 PM ET by Mike Smith

13. 
    jc21 | Dec 15, 2003 09:56pm | #13

    You might George Nash's book Renovating Old Houses pretty helpful. http://www.taunton.com/store/pages/070624.asp  and as Bob mentioned, a subscription to the Old House Journal. An architect/ designer can certainly be helpful if he/she has experience with older homes. Think you and you wife need to sit down and figure out what you really want and how much you afford to spend. As previously mentioned, a good thorough inspection is in order to determine any structural/electrical/ mechanical problems that need to be rectified. When you have an idea of what you want and know what problems you are dealing with in the existing house, you'll have a much better starting point when you talk to an architect or designer and fewer chances of nasty surprises down the road.