I know this is an impossible question, but here goes .. I’m re-building a porch, just finished the framing, getting my Ipe delivered next week. I need a miter saw to cut it all to length (1×4 and 1×6, mostly straight cuts, a few 45s). Next project is to re-side the house. There seem to be an impossible array of choices … 8-10-12 inch, with or without slide, laser lines, etc., with prices ranging from $99 to $800 plus. As an alternative, I’m considering taking my 25 year old Craftsman radial arm saw, which has served me well (and which I am very comfortable using) from the basement and hauling it over to the job site, and using it, rather than shelling out for a new saw (as much as I am coveting one!).
Can anyone offer help on decision criteria, brands, and opinion on just using the radial arm say? I’m an amateur, renovating an old house – this is not my profession, so it will get used only in short bursts a couple times a year.
Thanks, Bill.
Replies
Bill, a 12" Dewalt compound miter saw is good for your needs. I have used these saws for a lot of years, they're a good buy for the money. I do not own one as I use a Milwaukee slidesaw in the shop and a low cost Delta for most installations.For one saw I would check the Dewalt out.
mike
Bill
Just to make things more interesting and to confuse you a bit, I would look at the Milwaukee slider or maybe the Hitachi slider, use both and like both for some different reasons, also worth looking at is the Makita's
I dont buy yellow so I would advise the same.
There are going to be more come in here and list some of the other brands as well.
Doug
In this case go with the 10" Milwaukee or 10" Bosch. A 12" Bosch would be over kill. Yellers are waste of money. To get by on occasion thing go for gray.
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
I have the DeWalt 705 and love it to death. I have a Hitachi 10" that is great for trim. My current customer has two Delta 10" saws, one compound, one not. I have been using the compound one and have been quite impressed with it. For less than full speed ahead full time use it looks like a cost effective tool. Barely capacity for 6" stock though. Leaves a matchstick size uncut if you don't lift the board or put a piece of stock on the bed of the fence to raise the workpiece.
Twelve" saws are great but a lot of weight if you do not need that much saw.
Bill,
After a series of tests I found the Dewalt compound mitre saw to be the best for me.. Please don't limit yourself by buying a 10 inch saw (they are cheaper but do a lot less) and don't buy just a mitre saw the sliding feature is one that really adds to the value of it.. I regularly cut 12 inch boards with mine and they are cabinet grade cuts. If I were so inclined I could build furniture with it, it's that good but the great thing is how handy it is..
My first attempt was with a radial arm saw since I saw so many around.. but using the radial arm saw scared me and the compound never does.. In fact my first use of the saw was to build an exact scale model of the timberframe I intended to build.. it was amazing to make those tiny cuts as accuritely as I did.
Since then I've used it to build the actual timber frame.. many times making the same exact cut full scale that I did on the model.. some of the timbers I've put on it are giant but the cut is so smooth and accurite that my purchase made sense. I can highly recommend the Dewalt compound mitre saw..
Bill don't lste to this dude (frenchy)... He's weird...
Who ever invented work didn't know how to fish....
have several miter saws, my favourite is a 12 inch compound dewalt, but the others are 10 inch, additional blade mass of the 12 inch makes a difference im sure, the 10's are deltas
i routinely cut miters in 6 inch prefinished crownmolding, flawlessly, on the dewalt
caulking is not a piece of trim
For Gods sake don't buy a Dewalt. Do yourself a favor and buy a 10" Hitachi , hands down the best miter saw . Tool Crib has it on sale now for $399.
Whats your beef with Dewalt? Although I generaly like Hitachi, the fence on that saw is almost nonexistant.
I bought a couple of their worm drives a few years back , junk. I have no reason to believe their miter saws are any different.
I would not limit my choices because of one type tool by a manufacturer not living up to your expectations. I have found the dewalt miter saws to be the industry standard with their tall fence being its best feature. I have the dual beveling 12" miter saw and can honestly say that it works to such a level of perfection that the wood itself is the determining factor. What more you could want out of a saw?
ANDYSZ2I MAY DISAGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING BUT I WILL DEFEND TO THE DEATH YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT.
Andy, If a tool works for you and you are happy with it that is all that really matters isn't it? What does it matter what someone else thinks? I was just offering my opinion on which miter saw to buy and that I don't care for Dewalt products.
I always wanted a dewalt 12 inch slider but could not afford it. Started the house I was going to buy one. Never needed it. I still want one.
I bought one of those green back and decker miter from wal mart, years ago for like $45, waiting for it to die. It will not. I use it every weekend, great for 2x4, pvc, etc. Forget anything over 6 inch wide. It will barely cut a 1x6, anything wider nope. Holding out for a slider, just cannot come off the wallet.
The best employee you can have but you wouldn't want him as a neighbor " He the shifty type"
What do the experts say? Are there some good tool reviews out there?
I ran Bosch 4412 through Amazon, and found some really really bad reviews.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000719WA/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
The DeWalt 708 seemed to have better feedback:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00002231F/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
The Hitachi has the fewest negative reviews, although the positives were not real strong.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000223L5/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
No one has mentioned the Porter Cable 3807. Here is a review of it. Short of ####c r a p p y blade guard and a cheap blade, everyone raved about the saw
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00004RC34/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
Makita has two offerings, a 10" and a 12". The 10" is cheap and if you buy it now, they will throw in a cordless driver drill and battery. $150 rebate guys. And it is the only one less than $500
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000223I3/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
Its big brother the LS1212 has the same rebate deal and raves:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00004R9M0/103-9506719-7050211?v=glance
Regards,
Boris
"Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934
Edited 11/17/2003 12:42:37 PM ET by Boris Yeltsin
Edited 11/17/2003 12:51:11 PM ET by Boris Yeltsin
Boris , thanks very much for posting all that . It was super of you to do it .
Tim Mooney
yellow blue el burro sabe mas que tu
I think it was Andy way back in the first dozen who had some sage advice a good saw guide like 16 or 18" long and a circular saw ( worm drive not a bad choice ) and you can cut compound miters at any bevel and angle you want just about and have unlimited usage of said tools all the while carrying your saw and guide in one hand without strain and that single malt your going to imbibe in when you complete the project in the other hand
that said I've had one of those 10" Makitas for many a moon and not one regret
have a carpenter friend helper w/ the 12 bevel either way sliding dewalt and that is one industrial strength fine saw
Actually, after reading all the reviews, I liked the Makita on paper the best, and I put a new 14.4 driver drill in my pocket and save $150 besides.
Regards,
Boris
"Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934
I am a building construction teacher. We have a 12" dewalt slider in shop. I like it.
But, I prefer my 12" porter Cable. It is great. Smooth, powerful, no problems at all. Great adjustable fence...I love it! It replace a 12" dewalt...hated the black blade gaurd and the knob for adjusting miters.
All - thanks for all the thoughtful comments. I guess I did start something of a religious debate, though. And to some extent, I was just looking for an excuse to buy a new toy. But in the end, I went with Andy's advice: a new blade for my circular saw, nice saw guide, and got it done! Rather than cut each board to fit between the house and the bread-board end (what was I thinking?), I left them all long, then cross-cut them all at once along the outer edge, then added the breadboard end to give the porch a nice finished look. I did have to do a lot of custom cuts where the porch met the house because it wraps around a couple of curved bays, but since those ends were tucked under the siding, I didn't have to be TOO obsessive about how accurate those were. I also had to deal with a corner - I did a herring-bone pattern rather than miter cut where it changed direction - I camphered the ends with a round-over bit, and it looks great - certainly no clue that I 'hand-cut' the square ends.
So with the money I saved, I guess I should be asking advice on single malt scotches? Actually, I already have a favorite (Laphroig) - as soon as I get the columns up and the temporary supports come down, I'll be getting into that!
Later ... Bill.
Glad to be of help Which saw guide did you get. I still haven't bought one for my self but I think I want the one that clamps underneath and you can accessorize with plates to attach saw or router. Sounds like a well done job and I like the idea of running long and making one cut I've never done that on siding but definately keep it in mind for the future. Post some pictures.
ANDYSZ2I MAY DISAGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING BUT I WILL DEFEND TO THE DEATH YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT.
Andy,
I would buy the Festo saw w/guide if you've got a few extra bucks. It's an amazing piece of machinery.
Steve
Andy - Not a fancy saw guide - just one of those aluminum triangles about 6 inches on an edge ... just held it tightly against the edge of the board and ran my saw against it ... one of those things I should have bought 25 years ago - less than $10.
I made all the cuts from the backside to eliminate the tear out on the finish side.
Cutting the ends all at once was a little un-nerving for a few reasons: I was cutting over a solid framing member, since the breadboard end needed a nailing surface, so I had to be careful with the depth of cut. I cut to a line rather than screwing down a straight edge (yikes), which went reasonably well, except that as the longer cut off pieces tried to fall, they kinda levered the saw off the line - imperceptable, but made it tough to stay on the line. Then I ran a router around it all to round-over the ends, painted on the anchor seal for the end grain (which also sealed the shallow cut in the framing below), and added the breadboard.
Pictures will be posted soon ... I don't want to celebrate prematurely - first the columns & stairs, then the scotch & pictures.
Bill.
I LOVE my DeWalt 12'' slider.
So far the brands mentioned are:
DeWalt, Delta, Milwaukee, Hitachi, Makita, and Bosch. 10" or 12".
We've really narrowed it down for you, haven't we!?
Figure out what you need to cut. What's the widest and/or thickest cut you'll be making. What angles will you be cutting. Then figure what size saw you need, 10" or 12", sliding or not, straight miter or compound. That will narrow it down a lot.
For cutting the vinyl siding, you could get by with a 4" sliding miter saw (not that anyone makes that).
Then go look at the selection of saws that meet those criteria. If there's more than one, play with them. Even if you can't plug them in and cut something, you can still make the various angle adjustments and pull the saw down, etc.
Which one seems to be the easiest to use? Which one seems to be the highest quality.
All of the companies mentioned are capable of making high quality tools. Some of the companies mentioned are capable of making less than high quality tools. So look 'em over.
I have a simple 10" power miter saw from Makita. I'm usually cutting baseboard, window and door casings, 2x4's, 2x6's(which I have to turn over to get that last little bit cut). The saw is great for my needs, doesn't take much room in the van, and is easy to grab and carry.
Rich Beckman
Another day, another tool.
Unless you're just looking for an excuse to buy a new tool (not that there's anything wrong with that) use your radial arm saw. It will do the job and you're comfortable with it. Moving it is a pain but you aren't going to carry it to a bunch of job sites.
P.S. I like my 12"yellow slider.
Smile. It could be worse. You could be me working for you.
If you really think that you won't use the saw alot I would have to say use the radial arm saw and save the money. On the other hand if you will be using it more a miter saw is nice. I like my dewalt sliding miter. My only complaint is the positive stop makes it hard to make very small adjustments that are sometimes needed to get those real tight fits on trim. Also if you are going to be doing lots of precision work you will want to invest in a good blade. I like the Tenryu blades , they are good blades at a fairly good price. Because of the large blade size you will get a little bit of distortion when cutting into hardwood so take those cuts with great care or your blade will drift a 64th or so . The saw is also very heavy.
I've tried the Hitachi 10"and wood have to say that it is my least favorite saw but there is a 8" that hitachi makes that is a great saw for trim but a little too small for alot of the other stuff that you will probably want to do in the future.
I feel that the dewalt sliding miter is the most versatile saw that you are going to find this makes it the best value in my eyes.
Ive got a dewalt 12 inch compound that ive had for at least 12 years and its never had a single problem. Probably trimmed out over 300 houses with it. Every tool review ive ever seen has had dewalt miter saws at the top or near the top. Sure dewalt makes some junk tools but so does every other manufacturer. There may be others as good or better but anyone who says a dewalt miter saw is junk is going by a standard other than performance. I buy what works not what color I like.
My dad bought the 8 1/2" Hitatchi (slider) 5 or 6 years ago. I've been using for about the same, and it works great. It tranports well too. I've noticed it seems to have one of the larger angle capacities (the table reads from 45 to 57 i think. And now, with the 10" version out, the price on the 8 1/2" took a plunge. It's deffinately a great saw, and I'd reccommend it to anyone. (I just wish it could cut 4x4's in one pass).
I wouln't buy a miter saw at all . Set up circle saw with cornice grade blade. Buy a nice saw guide and build a good work surface and cut right on sight. You got the radial arm for your fine cutting the miter saw would sit for monthes if not years unused.
ANDYSZ2
I MAY DISAGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING BUT I WILL DEFEND TO THE DEATH YOUR RIGHT TO SAY IT.
Bill, count the votes you have thus far ! Now count mine ;
Rated #1 in my shop,# 708 12 inch Dewalt slider [yellow].
#2 Makita 12 inch slider
#3 Dewalt # 705 12 inch chop saw [yellow]
#4 a very old Rockwell 9 inch chop saw that just would never die and still gets loaded occasionally!
The 708 was chosen for the shop saw that doesnt move to replace both a radial and an old delta trim saw that died before its time. I think a radial has a great place in a shop, but not on the move. I used to make trusses on the job with the radial, but dont get me into that subject ! LOL!
Dewalt has had some problems with triggers in small tools . Its not the same trigger in the big tools. Other than the trigger problem , I know of no problems to date that are that multiple.
Seems you could get by just fine with a #705 chop saw [ under 300.00], or no purchase at all.
Tim Mooney
I have worked for many years with an older model (yellow)12" miter that died and a model 1211 Makita 12" slider that was abused buy our employees but still works. I liked them both for their designed intentions.
I would have to say that a standard miter is easier to carry to the job, but I would pick a slider hands down for it's versatility. Our replacement for the old yellow miter saw was a new 12" DeWalt slider. Not a bad saw! We have since purchased another Makita 12" slider model #1212, by far the better of the two purchases.
The Makita has a smooth start motor, is more compact and has a direct drive instead of a belt drive(maintenance issue) like the DeWalt. We do a lot of finish work on site and would rather be slightly inconvenienced by a heavier saw that is a better quality and more versatile unit.
I will probably buy a Bosch 12" slider next time around. All the tests say it is a great saw? Sometimes you can get a cheaper tool that will last longer than it should, but most of the time you get what you pay for! Quality cost money. Like my uncle use to say, "you can't make chicken soup with chicken s*@#!"
Hope we haven't confused Bill to much?
John
The reasons you state is the reasons the Makita gets hauled , but its more expensive. I like the blue stream too.
Tim Mooney
Myphilosophy is to buy a saw that can do many things, not just the job at hand. (siding in your case) My vote is the Hitachi 10" scm. I use it all day every day- gets a new blade sharpening once a month needed or not. Everyone on the jobsite likes to use my saw. BUT i was looking at the new 12" Bosch..........
I just don't know if I can carry it....
Don't know how you feel about ebay but here is one that looks interesting. As of 7:13PM Sunday it was $20 plus a reasonable shipping amount ($20). Not much risk for a pretty good saw.
Edited 11/16/2003 7:14:33 PM ET by RASCONC
Edited 11/16/2003 10:55:39 PM ET by RASCONC
I like my Hitachi 8". I've used the s h i t out of it, and it is pretty much junk at this point, but a great saw for 10 years. I would get the 10" in a heartbeat and may. I am very interested in this thread.
Some questions for the group:
What is the largest sliding miter? 10 inches, right?
What is the largest capacity sliding miter? About the same right?
I will tell you, having looked at all of them, that the control placement is an issue. Some of them are up front, and some at the side. Some slide better, but the controls are funky. Some have great controls but the mechanism is funky.
From what I saw, I liked the Hitachi 10" or the Porter Cable. The PC had a nice rebate going, so you got like $50 bucks back. Probably has expired, though.
Boris
"Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934
Bill,
Check out the Ridgid 12" compound miter with lazer at HD. I bought it 2 weeks ago and its great. Its a great deal at $299. You get a metal stand for it, it has the lazer, and it comes with an extended fence as well as a clamp. Those to extras, I believe, are not included with the DeWalt and cost you more. Just a thought.
Thanks,
Barney
Set up your radial arm saw and use it. Save your money, or buy something else you need for the job. In my opinion a good radial arm saw will do everything a slide compound will do. I had a good Dewalt 10-incher for years, but sold it to buy a contractors table saw. The only downside for the radial is moving it from place to place, so if you aren't having to do that much, go with things as-is.
Now, how about a good jointer, bandsaw, router with table, sanding equipment, spray painting gear, nailguns, compressors? Or maybe just some good single malt scotches?
Sort of like starting an argument over religion.
Just get something really nice with a stand that has wheels so that I can borrow it easily.
You can bum the scotch off your brother...
dont buy the small ridged the guard sucks, ive got 12 DeWalt and 12 DeWalt slide and love them but you sound like you dont need the extra beef, you can get a delta 10 compound saw for 100.00 or less and it would be all you would ever need if you have a sams arround you they have it with a few extra goodies just in time to give yourself for xmiss . good luck dogboy