Replies

1. 
   glacierfergus | Dec 17, 2010 07:10pm | #1

   That depends

   If you are mitering corners on windows and doors, and your baseboards are coped/mitered in corners, I would definitely stain and finish them first.  There are only two situations I have found where is can be advantageous to cut first and stain/finsh second:  when I have to build a special piece of trim to solve an unusual problem (read rip, cut and router/shaper a piece to cover something strange) or when I am doing a trim style that will expose the cut ends. 

1. 
   calvin | Dec 17, 2010 09:40pm | #2

   As usual, it depends.

   Nothing beats being able to fine tune with a chisel or sandpaper.  With prefinished, that option is limited.  Still, putzing with prestained can be tough to blend in.

   Stain yes, but final finish-pain in the rear.

   Can be done, but think prefinished trims on kitchen cabinets.  Cut and FIT rather than cut, fit and FINISH.

   But, for just door/window casing-not as big a deal.

1. 
   Scott | Dec 17, 2010 10:29pm | #3

   >>>Stain yes, but final

   >>>Stain yes, but final finish-pain in the rear.

   That's what I was thinking. I like to brush at least one, preferably two coats of final finish with the product in it's final resting place. That way end grain, countersunk fasteners, filled spots, and minor imperfections all get sealed.

2. 
   DanH | Dec 17, 2010 11:10pm | #4

   Are the walls already painted?  If not it makes it more practical to put the trim up before finishing, since you can paint over the stain on the walls.

   But finishing the trim before cutting goes fast and works well if you don't have to, say, plane some edges to make things fit.  You an generally dab a little stain on the joint areas to darken any slightly visible white wood, though if you have to leave visible cut edges then they will need a more complete treatment.

   Certainly with painted trim you should at least do a first coat ahead of time.  You can then come back and touch up or repaint after the trim's in place, but you don't need to do a particularly thorough job.

3. 
   Piffin | Dec 18, 2010 06:10pm | #5

   matter of opinion
   six of one, half dozen t'other...

   You'll know what your OPINE IS AFTER YOU DO A COUPLE EACH WAY

4. 
   BossHog | Dec 19, 2010 07:04am | #6

   If you stain and finish it before installing, sometimes when the miters open up a bit on casing it will expose a bit of un-stained wood.

   To prevent that, put a little stain on the miters before installing.  That will help hide a lot of gaps.

1. 
   calvin | Dec 19, 2010 07:13am | #7

   Ron

   Putting stain on very much of the cut portion of the mitre will prohibit glue from getting a good bite.  I wouldn't do it.  I glue all mitres and cross nail.  Provided there's no structural movement, no opening of the mitres. 

   I've read occasional posts on the poor gluing potential of end grain.  While that may be true-that's no excuse for opening mitres.  Either too much movement or poor install in the first place.  Larger trims I'll bisquit for alignment help and to further secure the long mitre cut.

   I also get a kick out of reading "I've done thousands of kitchens and............."  Well, I've not done thousands of anything but maybe mitre joining, so here I might be tempted to say that.

2. 
   Piffin | Dec 19, 2010 08:38am | #8

   Rather than hide or disguise a gap, I prefer to prevent it with glue.

   If a gap does come, I use wax stick filler to hide it

1. 
   DanH | Dec 19, 2010 09:03am | #9

   Of course, whether you'll use glue or not figures into the finish now/later decision.  If you finish after install then you'll have to deal with squeeze-out causing the stain to not 'take".

1. 
   Piffin | Dec 19, 2010 09:36am | #10

   I know it's early AM on
   I know it's early AM on Sunday and all, but you really need to wake up and pay attention, Dan. The context of my glue comment was with pre-stained, so your followup is completely redundant and un-necessary

2. 
   calvin | Dec 19, 2010 01:02pm | #11

   Dan

    Use of tools, material and labor is something that can be taught and I've no doubt it's done to various standards.  Even with that knowledge, there's certain things that separate the excellent from the good.  Knowing what to do and how to do it right will lead you beyond the status quo.

   no?

1. 
   DanH | Dec 19, 2010 02:45pm | #12

   I was just pointing out a consideration with regard to the OP's original question -- didn't imply whether gluing was good or bad, just pointing out the conflict between gluing and finishing after install.

   But since you bring it up:  Yes, there are different levels of quality, but not every job demands the absolutely best quality you can muster.  The vast majority of homes in this country, for example, do not have glued trim (unless you count the construction adhesive on the back side).  Is this "excellent"?  Probably not, but the trim still looks good (in most cases) and does its several jobs reasonably well.  The (stained and varnished oak) trim on this 34-year-old house isn't glued, but the carp (who was not the most careful guy) did corner-nail the joints, and most (at least 90%) are still perfectly tight.  (In fact, I just checked about a dozen doors and windows and couldn't find any where you could get a fingernail in.)

   I'm not saying one shouldn't glue the joints -- I'm just saying that there are options and trade-offs, and sometimes getting the job done faster is worth considering vs doing the "absolute best".

2. 
   calvin | Dec 19, 2010 03:46pm | #13

   Dan

   You won't get me nodding my head in agreement on this one.  Glue, cross nail, period.  The moment of time and the cost of the glue for something that will last...................

   Anything less is that pennywise, pound foolish thing.

   Easier and quicker to not sand off the planer marks too, but is that a finish that's anyway acceptable?

   Might as well buy a used paneled trailer with metal split jambs.

   Anything else is a worthless cheap trim job.  I'm not even talking "absolute best". 

   "options, trade-offs, faster"?

   why even bother.

   I am happy your trim is fine.

3. 
   DanH | Dec 19, 2010 04:27pm | #14

   Sometimes affordablility has to take precedence over "best".  It's not like an occasional open miter will cause the house to fall down -- durability is not affected.

   In fact, this belief that everyone must have "the best" is a big part of what led to the housing bubble.  Yes, many people couldn't differentiate between bigger and better quality, but in general there was a rush to buy the more expensive option vs the one that would provide the HO the most value for his money.

   (Of course, I realize that this forum is "Fine Homebuilding", so that is the bias, but to deny that anything else is a valid option is just advocating the continuation of the disastrous course that the industry has followed for the past 15-20 years.)

4. 
   calvin | Dec 19, 2010 06:38pm | #15

   Dan

   You've got to be kidding me.

   Glued mitres equated with burst housing bubble?

   No way.