Window trim is it really necessary?
I am installing 8 1/4 ” fiber cement lap siding on my flat roof mid-century modern home. I have installed new aluminum windows and doors that are 1″ proud of the sheathing. I would like to forgo the traditional window trim an simply run the the lap siding right up to the window frame (allowing 1/8 for expansion and caulk of course) Is this asking for trouble or as my wife likes to say “felony stupid”?
I like the very clean linear, look but don’t want to create problems down the line.
The window openings have been flashed with Vycor under and over the nail fin and drip cap has been installed as well. I’m not sure trim adds much in the way of weather proofing in this scenario but don’t hesitate to call it like you see it.
No holds barred,
I’m trying to think like water! Thanks in advance,
Paul
Replies
It sounds like the flashing is OK and it will keep the weather out. It may have an unfinished look. Trim can add a lot of curb appeal and profoundly increase the value of your home if you opt outside the mediocre four piece #### that most builders do. Here is a drawing of my typical detail with mucho curb appeal.
Except that detail has NOTHING to do with mid century modern. To the o.p., go for it. Window trim, on it's own, provides no extra weather barrier. It's all about the detailing, with or without trim.
Mike,
Nice detailing. Do you make the 4-1/2" cap with the 10-degree bevel yourself? If so, how do you go about making it?
I personally agree with you that such traditional detailing makes for a much nicer house, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, yada yada yada. ;)
Edited 11/1/2007 1:52 am ET by Ragnar17
I start with 2.25" thick stock. It requires two passes on the table saw because the saw will only rip 3 inches deep. I Have access to lots of old redwood 2x4s that are 2.25" x 4.5".Mike Callahan, Lake Tahoe, Ca.
I have the same tastes as you. I much prefer the look of the brickmold and no board surround combined with lap siding. I've installed hundreds of windows with that detail. No issues from doing it. In fact, I believe that the board siding adds another entry point and allows more water intrusion.
FKA Blue (eyeddevil)
Jim,
Brickmold IS a trim
Welcome to the Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime. where ... Excellence is its own reward!
There is no problem with your planned method.
No trim versus trim is simply a matter of eye appeal to the beholder.
The windows on our house are "picture framed" with brick mold, with the hardboard siding (very similar to fiber/cement) run to 1/8" and caulked. Shutters on the front of the house, but no other trim to speak of.
I like the look, and you certainly don't need anything more to be reasonably weather-tight. Fancier trim just adds more joints and more places to leak.
Here's a shot of our house -- 8" hardboard, brick mold, 30-year-old Andersen windows.
View Image
If window casings were required on the exterior, the manufactuirers would be providing them or explicitly instruting you to use them.
It is a matter of taste and style.
The danger here is offending your wife's sensibilities. Do that too often and you get to spend more time enjoying the look of these windows from the outside.
;)
Welcome to the
Taunton University of Knowledge FHB Campus at Breaktime.
where ...
Excellence is its own reward!
Thanks to all for you're advice and opinions. I really like a clean, contemporary, uncluttered look. The pictures gave a good example for my application. Fortunately my wife shares my tastes. Her concerns are primarily making sure that we do this right. She handles large construction defect cases and has probably seen more costly mistakes than most.
Anyway thanks to all for your continued help and advice. This site has been a tremendous resource for our project.
Paul
No problem . The wife does realize she is now part of the family and is expected to help out those who need her assistance here right ? Paybacks are hell! ;-)
They can't get your Goat if you don't tell them where it is hidden.
Absolutely. giving free advice here is the only way she'll shorten her sentence in purgatory for being a lawyer.
I've done quite a few window replacements where the stucco runs right up to the window frame (i.e. no "trim"). Since I always use new construction windows, I have to break the stucco back to replace the old window. I like to add trim like in this picture because:
My .02 worth. - lol
That's not much different from brick mold, which would serve the same purpose.
If your view never changes you're following the wrong leader
Dan -
Here in CA, I see quite a bit of stucco mold (stucco mold has a groove on the edge to "key" the stucco) around windows, but it's often narrower than the nailing fin on the windows - and doesn't usually have the sloped drip edge at the bottom. Many houses, however, have no trim at all - the stucco runs right up the the window frame.
I came up with the frame in the picture while replacing all my single glazed aluminum windows with double glazed, low-e, windows. I use KD 2" x 4" stock to make the frame pieces, assemble them with glue and screws, and prime all surfaces before they're installed. Then, I patch in the stucco and turn the whole thing over to the painter.
I did mine about 10 years ago and the neighbors loved "the look". I got three window jobs on my street. I loved that commute. - lol
Definitely. Did a repair a few years ago that was detailed as you describe. But the hack that put the windows in left out crucial pieces. The drip mould and flashing. It probably would have been alright if they were self flashing windows but the remodel predated that.
Needless to say it was a soggy rotten mess. Rebuilt it the way the original design was probably supposed to be like and put in the needed drip edge and flashing.