wood floor finish,whats best?
alwaysoverbudget
| Posted in Construction Techniques on
well i’m about to tackle refinishing some old oak floors, this is my first whack at it so i’m a little lost. what would be the best finish to put on-oil or water. [that ought to start a debate!] and what brand would you go with? use sanding sealer? i have done some refinishing where i just scuffed the old surface and applied the finish. have used varathane water based and also minwax oil ,both were ok, but i’d like to find a little better product. next question , has anyone ever sprayed a floor? i’ve made my living painting cars so pretty adept with a gun, i’m just thinking it would leave a very smooth finish, but would probably take a extra coat or two. thanks larry
Replies
Define BEST!
good question best: my definition! something a newby could apply without getting in over there head. flows out well, with a good wear life and finally is refinshable 10-15 years down the road. i hear alot about gitza but don't no where to get it, sounds like it's a little smeller than most, but thats not a problem as house ie empty. thanks larry my english teacher would be proud i think i manged to make up 2 words in one paragraph!!!!!
One coat of Pergo.
oil base, try fabulon polyurethane very durable, excellent flow characteristics will keep you out of trouble applying w lamb's wool applicator lightly dunk it and press off excess on metal painter's mesh, avoid pouring it on apply in controlled "shuffleboard" pattern and go only as far as applicator tells you to, like brush painting use light to check for missed areas on surface while applying skip the sealer, just use 3 coats of the poly... sealer can be softer, so first coat may not be very durable
or, use oil polyurethane based sealer for floors (not lacquer)to make screening first coat w raised grain easier and to avoid swirl marks then add 4th coat so there are 3 coats of hard-wearing poly on top of the sealer oilbase has more solids than waterborne ur house is vacant, smell is not an issue
several good water borne polys, but more expensive NEED to use dedicated waterborne applicator (inexpensive) AND any REQUIRED sealer for that brand it is a bonding agent; if skipped the waterborne can be difficult to flow, doesn't look as good ...can recommend Emulsion type from basic coatings, hybrid water/oil poly w high solid content, self-sealing out of bottle, good flow
might stay away from air application, hard to adjust for spraying on the flat vs spraying horizontal/vertical surfaces would use air only for oilbase poly
just thought i'd let ya know i got the fabulon and just finished my 3rd coat tonight, that is a great product thanks for telling me about it. the flow charastics are outstanding. one question, why do you need to scuff between coats- for adhesion purposes or to knock the dirt nibs down.between my 2-3rd coat it really looked good but i went ahead and lightly screen it. last coat was satin we'll see what it looks like tommorrow thanks larry
glad you had good luck with it, fabulon is a very good material you screen after the 1st coat because the poly raises the grain and the surface is rough second coat looks much better, but some grain can still be raised in the softer/drier portion of grain; also to knock down the grit you mentioned that was airborne third coat, control airflow into workarea to avoid dust 3rd coat really brings out the job
2 coats Fabulon gloss poly last coat it (third coat)with a matt finish if you dont want gloss.
The best is a moisture cure finish but dont try it yourself..
IMHO I'd suggest you get a pro to do it. It'll be more cost effective.
Did you consider renting a machine and the screens to screen between coats?
You'll need the machine for three days to screen the first three days/coats....That costs money and you better know what yer doing.
I never in my life ever heard of spraying a wood floor not to say it cant be done but....
MAybe its me but on floors and walls int and ext I feel that paint or urethanes go on better with rollers, lambs wool pads or brushes because it works its way into all the gooves that sprayers don't....unlike a car which isnt pourus.
If I were you I'd get a pro to do it right.
Be floored
andy
The secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
Edited 8/9/2004 3:25 pm ET by Andy Clifford(Andybuildz)
thanks ed and andy for some good info, you suggest hiring it done. i'm one of those guys that it kills to not do it myself,i'm having the rock hung and finished right now and i feel guilty that i'm not doing it. but i also understand this is a job that could pay to hire done as it is a very visable,if i screw it up the whole house looks bad.i've got about 600 sf. looking at renting a machine 3 days =175 just a guess but 75-100 for sandpaper ,poly 3 gals. 150, misc probably take me to 500.plus you have to factor in the murpy factor for another 150. most guys around here charge 2.50 -300 to sand and refinish but most only put on 2 coats. so i'll just have to think how hard i want to work to save a grand. thanks for the info larry
hire it out bro....I know how to do it pretty good but I'd hire it outThe secret of Zen in two words is, "Not always so"!
http://CLIFFORDRENOVATIONS.COM
andy's right, hire it out never picked up it was ur 1st time, either going blind or it's the ahlzeimer's kicking up again drum or belt rental machines suck, too light so they bounce around operator needs to know the machine to have control if you do go for it, check out one of the vertical machines w multi 7" discs doing the sanding only rental machine i've seen a new guy have any luck with they get up close to wall, so edger "troughs" don't occur
i like gloss for 1st coat, even a second eliminates opaque look three coats of satin sometimes gives, usually in lesser brand of chemical all poly starts as gloss, it's the hardest sheen fillers to dull it down to satin or semi soften it point is, might have trouble screening it w buffer and screen or soft paper due to hardness, leave swirl marks which show up
need a third coat to protect and bring floor out, eliminate "dry" soft grain still visible after 2 coats i get housing rehab guys/contractors all the time who want to know savings w 2 coats always talk them into 3rd coat, sells the property $2.50 to 3. per sq ft is pretty good money you in high dollar area, west coast? not knockin' it, the work area sets the prices, but should get 3rd coat for that kind of dough
location is ks so not a lot of mega high dollar houses getting wood. tile is kinda the rage right now. but the 2.50 is kinda what everybody seems to quote. what they like to do is put on 2 sanding sealer coats and 1 poly and be gone. i'm going to get some bids and see what they have to say. thanks larry
Larry,
I am a novice and I did my cabin floor (1000 sq ft of syp strip). I first used a varnish product that didn't work at all. Then resanded and used Behr polyurethane from HD (it is a weekender and I wasn't after the ultimate floor finish). I am very surprised at how wonderfully the floors have held up. The Behr poly will definitely get a second look when I go to finish my floors in my new house (2000 sq ft of beech). And it was idiot proof as far as application. I used the drum sander for initial sand and that really does take a steady hand. Then I finished with a large floor buffing disk sander to smooth everything out. I'd say I got to about 85 or 90 percent of what a professional did at my first house (a 1940's bungalo in cleveland with oak floors).
And I didn't do it alone, I had much less qualified helpers and our floors turned out lovely. Good luck.
Rob Kress
they're giving you 3 coats and the sealers might be decent stuff Lenmar makes a gloss sealer polyurethane, their tech rep told me it cures up hard as the regular gloss poly mentioned the Fabulon because it's a gymnasium quality finish, easier to work with, smooth flow characteristics help coat the job evenly
well i went searching today for fabulon poly and come up empty handed,everybody handles minwax poly and thats it. where do you get yours maybe i could just call them and pay shipping. any other ideas where to find it on the internet. thanks larry
found this
Fabulon's Tech Service Group @ 1 800 289-7728
here
http://www.essex-silver-line.com/pro/fabulon.html
another site I found
http://www.whscott.com/fabulonpage2.htm
Adam
thnaks, i'll give essex tomorrow and see if they will ship.thanks larry
try the internet sources because they're set up to ship which the two warehouses i use are not check yellow pages in your area for floor finishes or flooring suppliers, they may sell direct to you
i've called essex and got 8 gals. coming . started sanding today with one of these flat orbital sanders. sanded 11 hrs today! boy is it slow. but almost idoit proof . thanks larry
glad to hear it is it one of the disc type or a flat pad w large sheet of paper? get a paint scraper to get into corners, keep fine file nearby, keep scraper blade sharp hope you make some money on it!
this isn't a paying job ,it's my own floor. if i was getting paid i'd be making about 35 cents a hour lol. the sander is the type that takes a big flat sheet. really sands smooth and flat,but my floors had been sanded with a belt type at sometime and they had chopped it up pretty good. so lots of sanding trying to flatten it out. looks pretty good just waiting on the fabulon to get here. planning on 2 coats gloss and 1 satin to kill the shine down a little. thanks larry
I hope it works for you, if it's a real PITA I hope it wasn't my advice that pushed you over the edge!
andy just wanted to let ya know i got the fabulon and it worked great ,thanks for the post. larry
I'd take a look at Waterlox, a tung oil/resin finish. More time and work to apply but worth the effort imho. http://www.waterlox.com//index.cfm
The Home Despot near me rents these pad sanders, random orbital with a 20" x 24" square sheet; I used it on a small floor I re-did and I was pretty happy with it. Very easy to control, the random orbit didn't gouge anything when I screwed up, the end result was pretty good; otoh sanding sheets are not cheap, and it's not for aggresive removal. With the cost of sanding sheets it was about $100/day. Might be worth a try, one room first to see how it goes?
i looked at one of those sq.sheet sanders, they looked like they would be pretty forgiving at not gouging the floor. what grits did you use ? i can see where thay owuldn't be good on new floor where you need to be more aggressive. thanks larry
I used it to refinish old fllors on a landing about 3'x3' and a bath floor about 4'x4' (yes the original bath floor was oak, it's an experiment, I can always tile it over). I think I bought 2-3 of every grit they stocked, I think it went from 60-180, and returned what I didn't use; I used each grit, working up, as instructed http://www.taunton.com/finehomebuilding/pages/h00113.asp (I am no floor pro so I do what I am told); I believe the highest grit was not fine enough for my liking and think I used just the velcro pad (which they make you buy a replacement for anyway) for between coats.
It is very forgving, you just can't gouge the floor, and it seemed heavy enough to me, seemed to stay on the floor. I used a water-based product (I forget which one, the despot carries it) b/c it was my only bath and I had only a day to do it, so I couldn't wait for an oil to cure. Water-based has the advantage of mulitple coats on the same rental day to save you $ on the sander, drying about 2-3 hrs between coats.
Edited 8/12/2004 11:34 am ET by RickD